An Interview with ‘Jedi: Survivor’s’ Aaron Contreras
Interview and Header Image by Cole Mihalich
Star Wars games are usually a rarity. Since Disney’s acquisition in 2012, the franchise has seen dozens of game projects canceled. During the majority of this time, Disney’s controversy-filled exclusivity partnership with Electronic Arts, saw fans repeatedly disappointed. From a loot box controversy to the shuttering of studios that were set to make anticipated games.
But in 2019, things changed with “Star Wars Jedi: Fallen Order.” The game, after some hesitation from fans, was released to critical acclaim. ‘Fallen Order’ was made by EA-owned Respawn Entertainment, known more for its history of excellent first-person shooters, than third-person action-adventure sagas. Due to the game’s wide success, a sequel was greenlit; “Star Wars Jedi: Survivor,” set to be the first game post-EA deal, and the first under Disney’s new Lucasfilm Games banner.
With a new level of trust given to Respawn, they had to deliver once again. Not just for fans, but to help shape the trajectory of the next decade of Star Wars games. And they delivered. “Jedi Survivor”, was released to widespread acclaim across the board, save for initial performance issues. The game was praised for its nostalgic, darker story, smooth gameplay, and brilliant art. It’s safe to say it’s one of the best Star Wars games ever made.
But it’s the teams and talent, not the corporate politics, that make these games a success. We spoke with one of ‘Jedi: Survivor’s’ key creatives, Aaron Contreras, the Narrative Director of the game. We learned about him, how he constructed his narrative team, and of course his spin on the Star Wars universe.
Note that there will be spoilers for the story of “Star Wars Jedi: Survivor” below.
Cole Mihalich: Where did you get your start in games?
AARON CONTRERAS: My first dev job was as a game master for an online text-based, pay-to-play roleplaying game. These online RPGs were called Multi-User Dungeons or MUDs and they were the precursor to MMORPGs.
I got pretty depressed while working there and ended up getting myself fired for poor performance. That led to a few years of failing over and over at landing a game design job while bouncing in and out of college or working entry-level jobs in and outside the game industry. I eventually got serious and adopted a ‘do or die’ approach, which led to me landing a job at Blizzard, as a night-shift Quality Assurance tester on World of Warcraft. I’ve been in the industry ever since.
Outside of MUDs, what would you consider to be your first writing job in the industry?
That was as a designer/writer on Mercenaries 2: World in Flames from Pandemic Studios. Mostly battle chatter and some dialogue for my missions. This was before ‘narrative designer’ existed as a title but it was pretty common (and still is) for narrative-centric designers to write for their own content. I never wanted to be a pure writer and have always been drawn to interactive narrative over linear content.
Later in your career when you joined the Respawn team. What from your prior experience do you think got you the job?
They were looking for a Narrative Lead who had a design background and clearly wanted someone who understood the values and priorities of a game design team. I remember looking at the job posting for the first time and thinking, “I probably won’t get this gig but it sure looks like they’re looking for me.”
Bringing us to now, you had over five years working with the team at Respawn. What did the structure of that team look like?
I reported to the Game Director, Stig Asmussen, who was a delight to work with. If there is one person responsible for the success of that franchise, it’s Stig. I directed the narrative team on Fallen Order and Survivor, which was made up of game writers and a larger number of narrative designers and narrative technical designers.
Most of my individual contributor time was spent writing and editing the other writers on both projects. Our narrative design teams, led by David Midgley and Todd Piperi, owned narrative systems (the cantina, conversation systems, companion characters, and various secondary systems like fishing) and also were responsible for the implementation of in-game dialogue.
Was Lucasfilm also a part of that dynamic?
Yes. There was constant communication with Lucasfilm on all aspects of the product but they are especially focused on story and character. A big part of my job as Narrative Director was collaborating with Lucasfilm and building an authentic Star Wars story that also served the goals and priorities of the game design team. The first major narrative milestone on both projects was when our story outline was approved through Lucasfilm.
That approval process changed during Survivor, where we were getting their notes on the story outline during the early months of the COVID lockdown. On Fallen Order, we’d fly up to San Francisco once or twice a month for on-site meetings where there was a lot of interest from both parties in making forward progress. During lockdown that turned into one or two remote meetings a week and paradoxically all of that availability bogged down the process. We eventually figured it out, and I think the relationship between Lucasfilm and the Jedi team is stronger than ever, but those first six months of lockdown made for interesting times.
Respawn is known for being a gameplay-centric studio – did the success of the Fallen Order give the narrative team more say about what was explored in Survivor?
Laughs. Oh no. But, you’re right, Respawn is known for being gameplay-centric in the best possible way: they have ridiculously talented designers and developers and empower them with ownership and autonomy. From my perspective, you don’t need to pick between gameplay or story. Those ingredients are never actually in contradiction with each other – that’s a false dichotomy. The best narrative you can create integrated harmoniously with the strongest gameplay is going to make the best holistic experience for players.
Finding the right balance of ingredients in a particular sequence or level – which constantly shifts over the course of a game – was more challenging during COVID and remote work. Instead of sitting in the same room and passing the controller around, we’d typically be watching one person play through a section of the game in their specific way over Zoom. It encouraged a sort of ‘you do you thing, then I do my thing’ approach where the moment-to-moment shared discoveries of in-person playtest was often lost.
It’s a bit like a band creating a song: you can record and share melodies and beats or get in the same room and jam. Both methods work and each has their strengths and weaknesses. I like to get in the same room when possible.
Many from your team have spoken about how organic the writing process is at Respawn. I’d imagine a big part of that is down to you in the actual assembly of those teams. What do you look for in new members?
Persistence is number one. Game development is hard, art is hard! I’ve worked on video games most of my adult life and it never feels, even with sequels, like you’re going through a solved process. There is always new technology, new challenges, and new approaches with each project. If you lack persistence – and engagement, that’s number two – you’re not going to be all there for the whole ride. Other good traits are humility, honesty, and fairness.
Generally good ones to have.
Laughs. Yeah, exactly. I can go deep on this topic.
By all means.
For Narrative, life experience is really valuable. We’re telling stories, often about people who don’t share our identity or lived experience. The more you’ve experienced the world, the more you’ll be able to empathize with people who aren’t like you. At the least, make an effort to be open-minded in a way that doesn’t compromise your values. As someone early in your career, you probably don’t have all the answers – because none of us do.
Another thing I look for is clarity in professional goals. Do you want to have a lot of creative control, or excellent work-life balance, or do you thrive on praise and acknowledgment? I’m personally driven to be part of the strongest team possible, which is a very conditional relationship. There is no right answer, but understanding what your professional goals are with clarity is an important part of creating a fulfilling career.
As a leader in a team that’s been given such a broad canvas, I’m sure you’re getting a lot of ideas thrown at you. What were some of the filters that determined what ended up in the game? What informed those filters?
My top-line direction was to cleave as close as possible to the original trilogy. So I watched – and encouraged the narrative team to watch – A New Hope, The Empire Strikes Back, and Return of the Jedi over and over.
Past that, we had a media reference document the Narrative team is probably sick of where I tried to document what may have inspired George Lucas when he was creating Star Wars. It has just about every film directed by Akira Kurosawa alongside a big ole list of Westerns and Spaghetti Westerns. At its heart Star Wars is a Samurai-Western filtered through the lens of a 1930s pulp science fiction serial. When working on the Jedi franchise, it was always a delight to watch something and realize, “George Lucas watched this, and I think I see how he used it in Star Wars.” Discovering those connections is like hearing an old song and realizing you’ve heard it sampled before.
What are some of the other ways that working on a game of this scale is artistically fulfilling to you?
Working on a high-performance, dedicated team packed full of people smarter and more talented than myself is immensely fulfilling. I grew up with Star Wars, and being able to contribute in some small way to the greatest multi-generational epic myth of our time is such an honor. It’s also a delight knowing that the audience is so engaged and broad – I think just about every deep cut, inside joke, or cheeky reference we’ve put into our games has been caught by someone on the internet.
Collaborating with the cast and crew on set was also a real highlight of my experience working on the Jedi games. You put so much time and effort into these characters and their story, dealing with resistance, cuts, compromises, and decisions by committee just to get something approved and on the page. You start to wonder if it was worth it – but then it reaches talent like Debra Wilson and Cameron Monaghan and it all comes to life better than you could have dreamed. It was such a delight to work alongside Tina Ivlev, Dan Roebuck, Noshir Dalal, and of course Elizabeth Grullon and the rest of our amazing cast. Our characters and stories became three-dimensional and meaningful in ways I never expected due to their talent and dedication.
One of the most affecting moments in the game is Cere’s death which is a purely cinematic scene and so much of that comes out of the performances. I think the scene is a great example of how honest and human the stories of the Jedi franchise are.
One of my favorite moments in the game. That scene was the result of some sad, solitary, nights working on the story outline during COVID lockdown. It’s also one of the scenes that changed the least from outline to script to shoot to what shipped. Credit is due to our Cinematic Director, Dori Arazi, and Performance Director, Tom Keegan. It’s one thing to write a scene but another to execute it in performance on camera. Dori and his team executed so well on the transition of Cere falling back, our reality blending from the past to the present where she impossibly falls into Cal’s arms. And of course, Debra and Cam absolutely nailed the performance.
Very proud of the end result and immensely appreciative of everyone who contributed.
In a moment like Cere’s death, hopefully, the player is invested enough to be emotional as well. What is taken into consideration when you want to align the player’s emotions with Cal’s?
We spend a great deal of time and effort towards building that investment and rapport. I’ve actually learned some language around this since working on Survivor. It’s called Player-Protagonist Parity (PPP). You want your player playing the game and the protagonist they are playing to be in parity in order to create the strongest immersion and emotional connection.
Of course, for every rule, there is an exception that proves it. Once you’ve spent the time and effort and earned rapport and parity between the player and protagonist, you can actually engage the audience further by messing with their relationship with the protagonist.
A beautiful example of this can be found in Red Dead Redemption 2, relatively late in the game, after you’ve played as the player character, Arthur Morgan, for dozens of hours. During a low-intensity gameplay sequence with a secondary character, there is a revelation about Arthur’s backstory which radically informs and changes the player’s understanding of who Arthur is. Even more shocking, Arthur reveals the information himself and does so quite casually, further messing with PPP. As a player, it was both surprising and delightful – and an experience you’re only going to get from an interactive experience. That sort of reveal just wouldn’t hit the same way in a cutscene or linear media.
With non-linear media, immersion in not just the characters but the world is vital.
Right! I really believe that our audience for the Jedi games wanted – more than anything else – simply to immerse themselves in an authentic, interactive Star Wars experience inhabiting the role of a Jedi protagonist. That’s why we put the cantina in Survivor – it allows players to sit and soak in the Star Wars.
Yes. Coruscant is a great example.
I vividly remember tracking the fan reaction and feedback online after Fallen Order – everyone wanted to go to Coruscant. But also, narratively, what’s the worst place in the galaxy for a Jedi to be? Laughs Let’s start the game there, right?
Same with the blaster. Our story was taking Cal to the edge of the Dark Side, and we knew Cal would be facing some tests and failing. What does it mean to be a Jedi in the dark times? For Cal, it was perfect that he picked up a blaster pistol as a symbol of his adaptation. I am always looking for those opportunities to have the gameplay and story support each other in a way that makes the overall experience stronger.
What were the big-picture goals for you and the team while making Survivor?
I appreciate how you felt that Fallen Order and Survivor were honest and human Star Wars stories. That reaction is exactly what I was working towards. Create something that honors why we’re all Star Wars fans and speaks to a broad audience. Hopefully, anyone who plays the games, no matter who they are, can find something they can relate to.
The biggest goal across the team was to fulfill the fantasy of being a Jedi, through the gameplay and music and story, and all the other ingredients. Do you want to be a Jedi? We want you to be a Jedi, too.
Star Wars Jedi Survivor is out now for PlayStation 5, Windows, and Xbox Series X/S.
